ITC Bridge > Paranormal > Paranormal - General > My very disturbing messages

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darrensweet Member   Joined:  Jun 26th, 2012 Location:  United Kingdom Posts:  40 Status:  Offline	Hi guys, having spent the last year having amazing contact with beings who described themselves to me as spirit guides, council of elders ( twice communicated), and the immediate responses to the asking of my questions. I had started to get a pretty good picture of the afterlife. This all clicked into place with what some top ITC contacts had experienced and i was feeling on top of the world.However certain things always bugged me and didnt seem right.One was the lack technological use by spirits of people who had been regressed, by top regressionists Brian Weiss and Michael Newton.Another was the existence of aliens, no doubt linked with the engineering of mankind, the consitent sightings and testimonies, secret bases and dodgy governments of the world. Enough evidence as the afterlife.What has blown the lid completely off all this is the last few sessions I have had and stated in an earlier post.It started with some mind blowing messages about helping these spirits "FIX THE BABEL SECRET". I had no idea what this meant, and only later did they tell me. This and other messages, which have turned so extreme and sickening, that i havent touched my box since, and probably wont.Basically my life is upside down at the moment in a big way and heres why. In a nutshell heres what they have said: Theres 3 trapped here, there is a doorway gaurded and someone cant pass: spacecamps in the ether: there is a weapon they call AARU, in a spirit lab ,and is a planet fragmental: after they kill visitors, they will humble us, they will take us up kiddy fault: we r valuable and they have brown garden : journeys with babies: dumb important: be respect planet elect we are anu: release the planet fix the children, the still dead: respect our respect graywolf ape - to me, they call me hybrid all the time and builder, and that hybrids are clever and not many like me: important to get with ship, they're coming, u r coming to our stable, heaven stunt:More messages : you cannot get to eden physically unless they free AARu: get moving the builder (me) you r able to problem solve: babel secret is a weapon: saviour give it back, bring back ship, merge with our level ease your pain: I think you can see here how disturbing these messages are, .I have sent some audio to a moderator here. I am very concerned.This is no joke. In fact anyone here who wants to study or analyse these be my guest, waveforms, audio whatever you can do, no problem whatsoever, i have nothing to hide. Is this a group of evil spirits hijacking my communications? I seriuosly hope so.All i can say is the audio is what it is, and what was said is said. It has made me read what other groups of the world have experienced, are saying, and what they think will happen, also read the ancient history of man, dna manipulation and engineering, ancient gods, the bible, starseeds, ascension, conspiracy theorists, etc as these messages have been filtering through my communications. I dont know what to say, honestly. They have also said how they are going to kill my daughter and mention hearts a few times. Very disturbing as you can see. In fact I apologise for posting this, but its the truth and hard to contain to myself any longer. If this is evil entities stealing my communications, then they are very detailed and led me on an amazing path of information and research, why would they do this, well that just doesnt make sense to me.The information sways heavily to alien contact - ships in the ether, taking of children, we are anu, brown garden, saviour stunt, coming to pick our perfect, they have also said to me..Guys as i have said, sorry for posting this but i really needed to share this as you can see its very concerning. Thanks, Darren.
CDS Member Joined:  Dec 27th, 2012 Location:  USA Posts:  24 Status:  Offline	Darren it's interesting stuff. I have seen this happen before with others where what seemed like a cooperative effort went crazy from the otherside. What's most interesting is your mention of Eden. A while back I was in communication with some that were claiming I could get them to Eden. It was very strange and made me stop in my tracks and wonder what they were talking about.
darrensweet Member   Joined:  Jun 26th, 2012 Location:  United Kingdom Posts:  40 Status:  Offline	Hi, yes it has gone very pear shaped and the information they are telling me is all i can say linking very strongly to alien contact, in my opinion.Just the things they are saying is disturbing.Like i said when you step outside of the life after death research box so to speak, which these disturbing messages have forced me to do, and see the bigger picture of what other people are saying as well as us ITC resarchers, I can come to no other conclusion and its not good. EDEN is the spirit world we go to.Another answer they gave me because i have been wary of alien contact for a while, is when i asked is there a battle between aliens and heaven, they replied NEVER STOP.There is no doubt in my mind that there are aliens here, just by messages alone, I was just wary also of perhaps a evil spirit group messing around but i just can't see it.I truly beleive there are two types of aliens involved as well.The AAru thing they mention as the weapon is also strange,as AAru is the egyptian afterlife, the so called field of reeds.They call this AAru a planet fragmental,Reseach the word fragmental.Something very big is going on in this world in my opinion, i cannot doubt my own ears.They mention Dumb important,dumb is underground base i think. If anyone is unsure of my post. Please do not hesitate to contact me pm or email and i will send you what you want.Thanks, Darren.
CDS Member Joined:  Dec 27th, 2012 Location:  USA Posts:  24 Status:  Offline	darrensweet wrote: EDEN is the spirit world we go to.So the ones looking for Eden are stuck, you think?
darrensweet Member   Joined:  Jun 26th, 2012 Location:  United Kingdom Posts:  40 Status:  Offline	Hi, maybe or they are in a lower realm .All i know is they have called me a disciple for eden, and to get there, in their words " PLANET TERRA, WILL MAKE, EDEN, IF YOU DONT, THIS LIFE, PAINFUL". Other itc researchers have been told about eden in great detail.The only downside to all this is the involvement of aliens it seems.Hope this helps , Darren.
CDS Member Joined:  Dec 27th, 2012 Location:  USA Posts:  24 Status:  Offline	darrensweet wrote: PLANET TERRA, WILL MAKE, EDEN, IF YOU DONT, THIS LIFE, PAINFULI take that as "Be good to Earth or we'll suffer" Thx!
darrensweet Member   Joined:  Jun 26th, 2012 Location:  United Kingdom Posts:  40 Status:  Offline	Hi, I take that as be good in all ways, especially to other people.They also say things like, have respect and be good.Thanks, Darren.
Gizmo Member Joined:  Dec 29th, 2012 Location:  Ohio USA Posts:  38 Status:  Offline	How can you be certain that the messages are credible?  Some entities are tricksters...they lead you down the garden path. What are your thoughts on the trustworthiness of the messages? (And it's weird.  That thing about "respect and be good." is almost ubiquitous with channeled beings.  What IS that?  Be good?  Really? ) Last edited on Dec 30th, 2012 05:50 AM by Gizmo
Drachenzahn Member   Joined:  Jun 13th, 2012 Location:    Posts:  30 Status:  Offline	Hi Darren  welcome to the club! I have started recording for EVP in January 2012 and it took less than 3 weeks until I had a standing contact with 4 different entities, three females and one male, who all introduced themselves with their first names and who were very nice and co-operative in the beginning... gaining my trust first, right... then they started to threaten me, commanding me to commit suicide in order to join them ("we want you to kill yourself with a knife"; "You will come with us or your mother will die", "We will kill your dogs" etc)... it got worse and worse until I ceased recording EVP and also IR video-taping. I had decided not to have anything to do anymore with such a bunch of scumbags, and most certainly I had no intention whatsoever to join them. When I ignored them, they started to pester me, my dogs and my sick mother with poltergeist activities (with independent witnesses), incessantly touching me just about everywhere, phantom smells, extreme coldness in the entire house despite running the furnace full throttle, attacks both at night-time in my sleep, and during daytime (attempt to suffocate me)... all kinds of stuff: a full-blown malevolent infestation. I fought back with getting lots of protective crystals, and that helped a great deal, but didn't stop it completely. I have found out their identities - all four are deceased humans: two convicted and beheaded murderesses, one extremely vain and half-mad italian marchesa, who had dabbled in the occult from early years, and one guy who had died in 1795 after spending 30 years in prison for all the bad deeds he had commited through his entire life: rape, fraud, libel, embezzling, attempted murder - you name it. Turned out these four had somehow had found each other on the other side and are now linked to some sort of group, and these "charming" astral pests had attached themselves to me. To make it short: it only stopped in December, last month, after the intervention of a medium and his circle of friends. A very intense experience, to say the least. One advice from me, because I know that it was vital: NEVER BE AFRAID OF THEM! They thrive on fear and terror. A good thing you did already: you have told about your experince. They don't like that, they don't want to be exposed (confirmation of that by my mediumistic friend who is quite a celebrity in his field), they thrive on closed systems - them and you - and they don't like to see that closed system broken up by telling about it. My two cents. cheers and good luck for the new year!
Drachenzahn Member   Joined:  Jun 13th, 2012 Location:    Posts:  30 Status:  Offline	darrensweet wrote: Hi, maybe or they are in a lower realm .All i know is they have called me a disciple for eden, and to get there, in their words " PLANET TERRA, WILL MAKE, EDEN, IF YOU DONT, THIS LIFE, PAINFUL". Other itc researchers have been told about eden in great detail.The only downside to all this is the involvement of aliens it seems.Hope this helps , Darren. Darren, my infestations first told me : "Christ has chosen you" When I told them I wasn't a christian believer, they told me, they were "witches" and Wicca members. When I told them I have nothing to do with either witches or Wicca, they tried to pass themselves off as Non-human entities..... Please be very, very careful in believing anything they tell you.
darrensweet Member   Joined:  Jun 26th, 2012 Location:  United Kingdom Posts:  40 Status:  Offline	Hi guys, yes i totally agree with you, in the beginning i was totally gullible and beleived everything, and you are right, we cannot beleive any of it to be credible, why i beleive about the eden part etc is because other ITC researchers have experienced that for many years and i also beleive there is a spirit world called eden. But as you say none of it is written in stone as to who we are talking too, just saying what they said, which obviousley changed.So yes we have to be careful and not beleive everything.It was a shock it went that way, from nice to bad.However for me there is no doubt about souls and eden and also aliens, because of other peoples experiences support this too. But who knows? Thanks, Darren.
darrensweet Member   Joined:  Jun 26th, 2012 Location:  United Kingdom Posts:  40 Status:  Offline	Hi , that is one hell of an experience you went through, and its crazy isnt it.Thanks for sharing and nice to know others experiences. Also, happy new year to you too.Thanks,Darren.
darrensweet Member   Joined:  Jun 26th, 2012 Location:  United Kingdom Posts:  40 Status:  Offline	Hi Gizmo, you are right there, we will never know the trustworthiness and yes it could be a trickster spirit i agree or evil entities or aliens.I did trust with all my heart in the beginning, which is when they were saying things of that nature, and that has changed considerably.It is shocking.Thanks Darren.
Gizmo Member Joined:  Dec 29th, 2012 Location:  Ohio USA Posts:  38 Status:  Offline	darrensweet wrote: Hi Gizmo, you are right there, we will never know the trustworthiness and yes it could be a trickster spirit i agree or evil entities or aliens.I did trust with all my heart in the beginning, which is when they were saying things of that nature, and that has changed considerably.It is shocking.Thanks Darren. That's the rub. At first, if you get contact or good information and they seem nice, or tell you they are angels...you can be lured into believing it all.  After all, this is exciting to be talking to a spirit, right?  The very act of being able to do so can make a believer out of someone, no?   But it's easy to jump from a belief in the existence of spirits to believing what they tell you is true. Red flags are if it asks you to do anything you are not comfortable with, or demands anything.  This is not a good sign. You must realize that by inviting them to speak with you, or initiating contact you have given them permission for further contact.  Ouija boards and EVP sessions might seem like good tools for curious people to use to contact loved ones who have died, or spirits of higher beings.  But, unfortunately, it doesn't ever seem to work this way. The entities typically invoked by these methods aren't necessarily nice.  In the hands of most of us, it isn't too fraught with danger because we are not too psychically open.  I am a dud, myself.  But if the person using these methods (and others like them that are designed to make contact) is a sensitive, all hell can break loose.  Pun intended. Paranormal forums are filled with examples of what happens when it all goes wrong.  This forum is a good point in case.  It's not a game or a hobby.  It's like playing Russian Roulette.  And curiosity can definitely "kill the cat."   Be careful. Oh, and Darren...If you have had long term contact with this bunch, expect them to get pissed off when you refuse to do it more.  (I think you should stop immediately, myself.  But I'm just a stranger on the internet, so I'm wouldn't expect anyone to take my advice.)  You might notice an upsurge in paranormal stuff happening for a bit.  But stand firm, and demand they leave and it will eventually stop.  You might have a battle on your hands for a while, though. Good luck.  Hang in there. Last edited on Jan 2nd, 2013 05:34 AM by Gizmo
CDS Member Joined:  Dec 27th, 2012 Location:  USA Posts:  24 Status:  Offline	Ya, Give it a break. Hey are you doing this at home?
darrensweet Member   Joined:  Jun 26th, 2012 Location:  United Kingdom Posts:  40 Status:  Offline	Hi guys, yes i do this at home, and i'm definetly going to give it a break.Nice one, Darren.
Spider Member   Joined:  Aug 11th, 2010 Location:    Posts:  209 Status:  Offline	I am glad people are responding to your situation. Unfortunately this happens a lot, and people made some good points to follow. 1. You have 'outed them', and that is good. They like to keep you engaged under a cloak of secrecy. Now that you have told others, you will get different opinions on how to handle it, thus taking their power away. 2. If they were creeps while living, they usually remain creeps after passing. They thrive on fear, and fear is a source of energy. They will try to wear you out, make you question your sanity. 3. Fear Factor.....it is all so unknown all of this, but some will zero in on certain concepts, the extraterestial has fascinated makind for many years, still widely unknown about, so what better way to control you by using something that you have researched and hadn't found answers to, to further frighten you with some made up extraterestrial goobly de gook to further continue your confusion? 4. Threats. What better way to make someone comply with your demands when you threaten the very things that one loves; family, especially harming children, pets, jobs, etc. 5. Anonymity. They can pretend to be what ever they please to be, good, bad, and the ugly. A good point made, if you are not comfortable with their requests, shut them down. Sure, they will act up and give another go at it, but if you refuse to play, they will go away. They need a captive audience. 6. Organizations. Using the names of a particular groups, or a particular term for something they want to intimidate you with can't mean much if they are the only ones who know about 'it'. I have heard the term 'Eden', 'Green Eden', 'The panel of 7', the 'Lottery' 'The Council of Elders', the 'Neither the Red nor the White'........the list is long. I was even told 'God is just a story'!! 7. Most that act this way are low level spirits, their time is running out, and they are desperate to keep a ahold of the living realm, what better way than to spew nonsense that sounds real and official? You become terrorized and scared, and you want to know what it is all about and they feed off that fear as a source of energy. I had a friend that interacted with what seemed to be some benign spirits, and as time wne ton, they became more demading, instilling strange ideas and concepts into her mind, she kept all of this to herself, but it reached a point where her husband actually had to have her commited. She became so paranoid and fearful. The sad part is while in hospital, even with all the meds they gave her, all the therapy couldn't combat what was happening to her. She finally had to play the game of compliance, all the while being told crazy things by the spirits. Once they felt she was ok to be released, once she got home, and laid down the law.....to put it mildly, she told them she wasn't going to listen anymore and wasn't going to play their games with them anymore. Oh how they tried to break her down!! It took a good 6-9 months before they finally left her alone. They could no longer intimidate her, so it wasn't fun for them anymore. They went away, she stopped doing anymore research work, stopped doing EVP sessions. Now a year and a half later, she will occasionally record, but she is taking it one step at a time. The low level spirits have tried to bother her a couple of times, she ignores them completely. Show no Fear
Drachenzahn Member   Joined:  Jun 13th, 2012 Location:    Posts:  30 Status:  Offline	Hey Darren I wholeheartedly agree with what Gizmo wrote in post #14 and what Spider says in post #17!!! I know from my experience that this kind of astral pests can be very sticky... you really should stop ANY form of contact, any form of acknowledgement at once. And please do not record at home anymore. My thoughts are with you. Last edited on Jan 2nd, 2013 10:40 AM by Drachenzahn
Gizmo Member Joined:  Dec 29th, 2012 Location:  Ohio USA Posts:  38 Status:  Offline	@  Spider- The woman you mentioned who was being tormented was most likely OPEN to sensing these entities.  It's not something she can help or control.  It just is what it is.  They can sense her back, too.  If you have any contact with her, it might be good to let her know this will not go away.  She is what she is.  So, for her to start recording EVPs after she knows how this can turn out is ill advised, to say the least. She doesn't seem to have the ability to shield or protect herself.   It is like she is walking into a sewer wearing leaky boots.  If it happened before, know that it can happen again.
Gizmo Member Joined:  Dec 29th, 2012 Location:  Ohio USA Posts:  38 Status:  Offline	Drachenzahn wrote: Hey Darren I wholeheartedly agree with what Gizmo wrote in post #14 and what Spider says in post #17!!! I know from my experience that this kind of astral pests can be very sticky... you really should stop ANY form of contact, any form of acknowledgement at once. And please do not record at home anymore. My thoughts are with you. Recording at home can be like inviting them to stay.  I'd agree - bad idea. You can get rid of your 'tools,' whatever they are, and do a house smudging for starters.  Also, declare out loud and firmly that you demand they go and leave you alone.  Don't ask.  Demand.  And don't listen to or ask for a reply.  This needs to be a one way communication. You tell them. Expect some flak. But stand your ground and show no fear.
Spider Member   Joined:  Aug 11th, 2010 Location:    Posts:  209 Status:  Offline	My friend has since recovered, and has learned how to shield herself. Yes, they do attempt it time to time, but she has learned to block them out. She is able to hear them in real time every now and then. She has chosen one particular person to speak with, and that person is her 'guide' now. No more monkey business anymore!! But she said she will for ever be vigilant in how she interacts with the spirit world. What she does now is type the question on her lap top and she will get repsonses either in real time or telepathically.
Spider Member   Joined:  Aug 11th, 2010 Location:    Posts:  209 Status:  Offline	My friend has since recovered, and has learned how to shield herself. Yes, they do attempt it time to time, but she has learned to block them out. She is able to hear them in real time every now and then. She has chosen one particular person to speak with, and that person is her 'guide' now. No more monkey business anymore!! But she said she will for ever be vigilant in how she interacts with the spirit world. What she does now is type the question on her lap top and she will get repsonses either in real time or telepathically.
TheTimeTraveller Member   Joined:  Jan 2nd, 2013 Location:    Posts:  1 Status:  Offline	[size=Darren,] I have been involved in this field for about five years, during which time I have accumulated a lot of information.  There is confirmation from reliable sources that malicious entities exist and they try to ingratiate themselves with unsuspecting people then switch to trying to terrorize them. I have had a longstanding correspondence with Drachenzahn.  Your experience and her experience are classic examples of malicious entities and the games that they play.   In her case, she called in a heavy who proved to be a very big gun indeed and nuked the evil shits who were trying to persecute her.  Why do they try to persecute people?  From much reading, I think that, apart from the fact that they were evil shits while alive, it is simply because they can. We have no idea of what mechanism permits discarnates to contact us but I have encountered countless cases where the communicating entities are either dead stupid or they enjoy leg-pulling. I have encountered some instances of people at this end being fed truckloads of total nonsense but the recipients are so awed that they have been “chosen” to receive great wisdom from on high that all logic and critical examination deserts them.     On the other side, it is reasonable to envisage the communicating entities pissing themselves with laughter. But you have done all the right things, starting from outing them.  They were counting on your suggestibility and you have shown them that you aren’t open to it.  They tried to frighten you but you have realized that they have absolutely zero ability to affect your life (or that of your family) in any way. The Time Traveller
Gizmo Member Joined:  Dec 29th, 2012 Location:  Ohio USA Posts:  38 Status:  Offline	I just had a long conversation last night with a friend who is (from birth) a sensitive and is inundated with contact, pretty much all the time. When you are in that position, the last thing you want is more contact, and the focus becomes how to shield; how to block; how to control the intrusions.  Once you move past the wish to get evidence, and concentrate on getting the interference to stop, it becomes a different ball game.  She wants people to show evidence, mostly to show she isn't alone in her experiences, but she isn't going to go out and ask for more contact herself.  She needs to dampen it down, not encourage more! She dealt with something over Christmas brought into the house by a friend of one of her kids.  It stayed.  It actually attacked her AND her daughter, throwing the daughter against a wall with some force.  We are not talking here about mischief or unpleasant dead guys.  She knew that this one wasn't human.  It took several days, and many tries to get it to go.  And she isn't totally convinced that it won't return. Point is, I think we seriously need to at least consider the idea that not all of these contacts are with human spirits.  Some have never been human, but when attracted into contact with humans, are tempted to connect and attack or attach. The types of spirits who contact through Ouija or divination methods tend to be thugs, whether they are human or not.  I don't mean to sound like a Debbie Downer, but this one point has made itself clear to me over the course of several years of searching for answers.  It's a dangerous game we play when we don't go into this with some kind of realization that we are groping in the dark, and we don't know what will bump into us as we search around for contact.
Drachenzahn Member   Joined:  Jun 13th, 2012 Location:    Posts:  30 Status:  Offline	Gizmo wrote:She dealt with something over Christmas brought into the house by a friend of one of her kids.  It stayed.  It actually attacked her AND her daughter, throwing the daughter against a wall with some force.  We are not talking here about mischief or unpleasant dead guys.  She knew that this one wasn't human.  It took several days, and many tries to get it to go.  And she isn't totally convinced that it won't return. Point is, I think we seriously need to at least consider the idea that not all of these contacts are with human spirits.  Some have never been human, but when attracted into contact with humans, are tempted to connect and attack or attach. The types of spirits who contact through Ouija or divination methods tend to be thugs, whether they are human or not.  I don't mean to sound like a Debbie Downer, but this one point has made itself clear to me over the course of several years of searching for answers.  It's a dangerous game we play when we don't go into this with some kind of realization that we are groping in the dark, and we don't know what will bump into us as we search around for contact." Goodness..... I agree, Gizmo, its like russian roulette, or picking up total strangers in a bar.... it is definitely NOT a fun game. I didn't even use Ouija or other divination methods, I just started to record for EVP , but my medium friend (who finally "nuked the evil shits") told me that I have a portal here that already existed before I had  started to record... and they have not been able to completely close that portal yet (gulp). I won't do ANYTHING anymore here that could even remotely be understood as an invitation for contact by any astral being, thats for sure. cheers all, Tani Last edited on Jan 3rd, 2013 10:37 AM by Drachenzahn
Gizmo Member Joined:  Dec 29th, 2012 Location:  Ohio USA Posts:  38 Status:  Offline	Tani, one of the things that has a proven track record with several people I know is Black Tourmaline, a stone.  CDS has used it with good results, and the friend I mentioned above said it sort of weakened and isolated the ugly thing she just dealt with.  It kind of appeared to trap it in a corner? I am seriously quite skeptical about all the crystal stories, but hey, if it works....worth a try. I'm not trying to sell anything here, nor do I know anyone who does.  I just found mine on Amazon for cheap.  You don't need to get a pretty one, anyway.  Mine is just a small hunk of crystal. I think it might have cost $3.00?   I keep it next to the bed, just in case all this attention to the topic attracts something.  RE: "Nuking" them by a medium: Some psychics are fantastic receivers.  They pick up amazing info, and see and feel things.  Predict things.  All sorts of information.  But they might have great skills at this and not have what has been described to me as psychic "pressure."  This is the sending part.  Your medium friend's nuking of the entity is a perfect description of "pressure." It has to do with the ability to push out.  Does that make sense?  My friend mentioned above also has "pressure."  She has always been able to "fill a room."  She said she just expands energetically- gets big!  (She's a small person physically.)  So, while she tends to be a bright beacon that attracts things, she also has an ability to get mad and zap them.  She has been aware, as a teenager, that when she was mad at someone and shot them a dirty look across a room, they would flinch even if they didn't see her.  LOL Glad you got rid of the nasties.
Drachenzahn Member   Joined:  Jun 13th, 2012 Location:    Posts:  30 Status:  Offline	Hey Gizmo In summer, when I really had it with the astral scumbags, I have provided myself not only with black turmaline, but also with black onyx, mountain crystals and most of all: hematite. I have found that hematite works best for me re protection, but also turmaline and onyx are very good (I have also several other gemstones, which I use more in healing, not so much in protection). Actually, it was Chris (CDS) who inspired me to try out protective stones and crystals - and they have worked miracles, I assure you. Thank you, Chris (waving) Re mediums: I found my medium friend through another friend, funny enough: I am living in Germany, my friend in Australia asked someone else in Australia, who is very active in our field of research, whether he knew anyone trustworthy in Germany re serious mediumistic power. This other friend had just met my medium friend and was very much impressed by his abilities.... in short, I got the phone number, I called the guy - and I was blown away by the charisma and feeling of calm, deep  knowledge, that came through even on the phone.... This guy works with a circle of friends in their sessions, and they held a  session on my behalf last month... they got pictures that were so accurate, it was mind-blowing. They also told me they had placed astral sentinels at the portal for the time being... anyway, it worked. I don't know whether the astrals have actually left (cause portal is not fully closed yet, as I said) but they don't pester anyone in our house anymore... whole athmosphere in here has changed.... I am really grateful.
Gizmo Member Joined:  Dec 29th, 2012 Location:  Ohio USA Posts:  38 Status:  Offline	I'm glad for you!

Posted: Jan 10th, 2013 03:54 PM

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Rachel EVP Voices Guest   Joined:  Location:    Posts:  Status:  Offline

I'm very interested to read of all of your experiences. I too have received threatening messages; some telling me when I was going to die and that I was ill (I wasn't and I'm still here). I have to admit I've been at this for a long time and quite expected something of the sort to happen at some point. There has only been one period of concern in over 30 years of researching; two people were physically struck in a sealed room whilst experimenting, you could hear the blows. The clips we recorded at that time featured two male voices, who I'm sure would have been the equivalent of muggers. It took three months for them to get the message that we weren't intimidated but we had to stop guests attending the sessions. If you have any nervousness, don't record and only experiment when you're in a positive frame of mind. Many of you have made very good points but ultimately you only have to remember one thing - you're alive, they're not - if it gets too much, cease recording. They'll soon get bored and move off if you don't pay them any attention. Rachel

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Last edited on Jan 19th, 2013 01:23 AM by pol

Posted: Jan 19th, 2013 03:20 PM

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Rachel EVP Voices Guest   Joined:  Location:    Posts:  Status:  Offline

Hello folks I hope you don't mind me playing devils advocate but I was very surprised that in an ITC forum there are members that consider the need for stones to ward off negative spirits/entities. I've read how crystals resonate at unique frequencies that supposedly effect spirits and our ability to link with them. In the many years I've been researching, I've not come across one case of activity that crystals had any measurable affect on, other than as a psychological prop - maybe that's enough of a benefit? A friend very kindly gave me some crystals that were used in the Scole Experiment, sadly they didn't have any affect when we tried using them. However I'm very sure that my friends testimony of their self illumination in the Scole Hole was genuine. I'm not saying it's all bunk but isn't it better to use your intelligence and common sense, than to rely on an inanimate object to make you feel better? I've witnessed solid objects being thrown across a room and electrical faults around the house coming and going seemingly at the will of an invisible entity, the only thing that keeps me hooked is how do they do it. Parapsychology NEEDS current cataloged, illustrated cases of activity for research. If you currently have activity, why not get involved with either the ASPR in America or the SPR in the UK. Both organisations I'm sure, would be glad to read your documented account. Best wishes, Rachel SPR: http://www.spr.ac.uk/main/ ASPR: http://www.aspr.com/ Last edited on Jan 19th, 2013 03:20 PM by

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Posted: Jan 19th, 2013 03:56 PM

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Rachel EVP Voices Guest   Joined:  Location:    Posts:  Status:  Offline

Hi Darren I'm convinced of their existence too but firmly believe that they can do very little to effect you unless you let them. Both my recordings and others whom I trust, would suggest that there is around us all the time, an intelligence of some kind that is able to communicate with us. Bricks and mortar aren't going to make a blind bit of difference to a poltergeist or spirit, wherever it is, our physics don't apply. Every experimenter and researcher I know has the odd thing happen that would suggest activity at home. There's nothing to fear except fear. I sleep next to my seance room that's been used for regular sittings for many years, sure I have some odd things happen and the electrics have a life of their own but it goes with the job. Don't be hesitant, be knowledgeable and read up on your subject before something you don't expect happens. If you are nervous before you begin then you're not in the right place. Take it seriously and you'll be fine. Best wishes, Rachel

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Last edited on Jan 20th, 2013 07:22 PM by pol

Hello folks

I hope you don't mind me playing devils advocate but I was very surprised that in an ITC forum there are members that consider the need for stones to ward off negative spirits/entities. I've read how crystals resonate at unique frequencies that supposedly effect spirits and our ability to link with them. In the many years I've been researching, I've not come across one case of activity that crystals had any measurable affect on, other than as a psychological prop - maybe that's enough of a benefit?

A friend very kindly gave me some crystals that were used in the Scole Experiment, sadly they didn't have any affect when we tried using them. However I'm very sure that my friends testimony of their self illumination in the Scole Hole was genuine. I'm not saying it's all bunk but isn't it better to use your intelligence and common sense, than to rely on an inanimate object to make you feel better?

I've witnessed solid objects being thrown across a room and electrical faults around the house coming and going seemingly at the will of an invisible entity, the only thing that keeps me hooked is how do they do it.

Parapsychology NEEDS current cataloged, illustrated cases of activity for research. If you currently have activity, why not get involved with either the ASPR in America or the SPR in the UK. Both organisations I'm sure, would be glad to read your documented account.

Best wishes, Rachel

SPR: http://www.spr.ac.uk/main/
ASPR: http://www.aspr.com/

Last edited on Jan 20th, 2013 08:44 PM by Gizmo

Posted: Jan 23rd, 2013 02:55 PM

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50th Post

Rachel EVP Voices Guest   Joined:  Location:    Posts:  Status:  Offline

Hi Gizmo We all have a right to our own opinions and the forum is a great place to discuss them, thank you for replying. I'm not sure I can agree with some of your points and I'm happy to talk about why... I think it's very rare that a mental or physical affliction can not be put down to an explainable cause, whether the sufferer wants to acknowledge it is another thing. I am not saying it's impossible but it's not common. It might pay the lady who experienced sleep troubles to explore the hypnagogic / hypnopompic hallucinations. They are quite common and most people will have them at some time in their life. I have remarkably vivid hypnagogic hallucinations when I drink too much wine and have a late night. Stress can also be a trigger. If you're interested have a look at this link : http://www.thepsychologist.org.uk/archive/archive_home.cfm?volumeID=22&editionID=178&ArticleID=1545 I'm not saying the stone won't work and yes I believe it is a placebo but as you said, if it works there is no harm other than to the wallet. As for ghosts, who said I don't believe in them?! Best wishes, Rachel

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Last edited on Jan 24th, 2013 05:40 PM by Gizmo

Posted: Jan 26th, 2013 06:14 PM

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54th Post

Rachel EVP Voices Guest   Joined:  Location:    Posts:  Status:  Offline

Hi Gizmo I had to chuckle, I must be awfully thick headed! I set out with the objective not to go on anybody else's word and believe only what I could experience and validate myself. It's been a decision I have never regretted. By all means consider, listen to and explore other's ideas but don't take them at face value. And I wouldn't expect anybody to do any differently with my research. Looking for patterns is fine and granted it is enjoyable but pareidolia has a nasty habit of creeping in when your guards not up. Finding meaning in synchronicity is a prime example. Going back to the subject heading of disturbing messages, I would suggest some recommendations before experimenters worry about a recording; Unless the recording is a class A, do blind listing tests and ask other people to listen without providing a translation. We all have subjective hearing and it may well be that you've misheard. Keep a diary with the times and dates of all recording sessions and any activity in the environment during or after the session. Asking witnesses to write their own version of events, this will help you understand exactly what did happen. When recording ask for the assistance of a trusted communicator that you have had contact with before. If nothing else, put it all in to perspective. When you stop listening to the recording, the threat is gone. Stop recording and you won't hear anything that upsets you. That really is all you need to remember. If those experimenting are absolutely certain that their message holds evidence of a threat and are worried then get in touch with a university research unit, there are many psychologists that would like to hear from them. Best wishes, Rachel

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Hi Gizmo

I had to chuckle, I must be awfully thick headed! I set out with the objective not to go on anybody else's word and believe only what I could experience and validate myself. It's been a decision I have never regretted. By all means consider, listen to and explore other's ideas but don't take them at face value. And I wouldn't expect anybody to do any differently with my research.

Looking for patterns is fine and granted it is enjoyable but pareidolia has a nasty habit of creeping in when your guards not up. Finding meaning in synchronicity is a prime example.

Going back to the subject heading of disturbing messages, I would suggest some recommendations before experimenters worry about a recording;
Unless the recording is a class A, do blind listing tests and ask other people to listen without providing a translation. We all have subjective hearing and it may well be that you've misheard. Keep a diary with the times and dates of all recording sessions and any activity in the environment during or after the session. Asking witnesses to write their own version of events, this will help you understand exactly what did happen. When recording ask for the assistance of a trusted communicator that you have had contact with before. If nothing else, put it all in to perspective. When you stop listening to the recording, the threat is gone. Stop recording and you won't hear anything that upsets you. That really is all you need to remember.

If those experimenting are absolutely certain that their message holds evidence of a threat and are worried then get in touch with a university research unit, there are many psychologists that would like to hear from them.

Best wishes,

Rachel

Last edited on Jan 26th, 2013 07:02 PM by Gizmo

Posted: Jan 27th, 2013 07:53 AM

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56th Post

Rachel EVP Voices Guest   Joined:  Location:    Posts:  Status:  Offline

Hello Gizmo I was surprised to read as a moderator that you're not familiar with the nature of EVPs. Radio waves and voice contamination are only a problem as you quite rightly said when no controls are in place. Should an experimenter use controls and voices persist, providing contextual messages, then they should be considered. To the best of my knowledge, nobody has been able to replicate EVPs by radio wave transmission. You may find it helpful to read Konstantin Raudive's book, Breakthough if you can lay your hands on a copy or look online at the work of Prof. Ernst Senkowski. Both will help you understand the process and method of EVP researchers. Again as a moderator I would strongly suggest you take part in some kind of research of your own. Reading about other peoples work is very interesting and you can learn a lot but you'll never know if you could take that information to the next step if you don't try. You may well be the person to make the next breakthrough. Whatever happens you'll be better equipped to help those in need of advice. You're perfectly right about looking at the bigger picture to see trends of reporting. I quite enjoy digging in the data to see what factors affect and drive those who write about phenomena. It's a fascinating time to be researching the subject, less than 100 years ago I'm sure we'd all have been burnt as witches! Best wishes, Rachel Last edited on Jan 27th, 2013 07:54 AM by

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Posted: Jan 27th, 2013 08:26 AM

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57th Post

hank Guest   Joined:  Location:    Posts:  Status:  Offline	Last edited on Jan 27th, 2013 01:30 PM by
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Posted: Jan 27th, 2013 08:58 AM

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Rachel EVP Voices Guest   Joined:  Location:    Posts:  Status:  Offline	I'm sure Gizmo is a very able moderator, I was only suggesting further reading might be advised. Best wishes, Rachel
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Last edited on Jan 27th, 2013 11:33 AM by Gizmo

Posted: Jan 27th, 2013 12:19 PM

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hank Guest   Joined:  Location:    Posts:  Status:  Offline	Last edited on Jan 27th, 2013 01:30 PM by
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Posted: Jan 27th, 2013 03:39 PM

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Rachel EVP Voices Guest   Joined:  Location:    Posts:  Status:  Offline

Hi Gizmo, all I couldn't have put it better myself. I'm utterly frustrated by the amount of air time given to "ghost hunters" with only a superficial understanding and no respect for the subject. If we choose to be taken seriously by scientists and engineers, then we as a community need to be credible. I fully appreciate that Darren has found messages disturbing but without a comprehensive, objective in-depth investigation, diagnosis through a forum is foolhardy; regardless of previous experience. True physical phenomena is rare and needs to be addressed directly not by Hocus Pocus divination. In a genuine case of activity, there is always a need for sympathetic support alongside a realistic approach to resolving or coming to terms with the situation. Fear has always been considered a key factor to the level of activity and as such it should be treated with sensitivity. If you glibly pronounce to Joe Bloggs who has reported activity in their home, that they have "attachments" causing the problem without doing any research, because it's what you believe, you will make the situation worse by encouraging negative associations with activity that may not actually exist. I'm sure you'll all of heard of Guy Lyon Playfair and his book on the Enfield Poltergeist, "This House is Haunted". I was lucky to catch up with him at an SPR meeting where they discussed the report. The family were terrified and the activity caused havoc in their day to day life. If you've seen the TV programme on YouTube, you'll be struck by how all invasive it was. What you don't see on that programme is all of the support the family needed and received, at the time and for a long time after. Unless you're prepared to put out the fire, don't stoke it! Best wishes, Rachel Last edited on Jan 27th, 2013 03:40 PM by

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Hi Gizmo, all

I couldn't have put it better myself. I'm utterly frustrated by the amount of air time given to "ghost hunters" with only a superficial understanding and no respect for the subject. If we choose to be taken seriously by scientists and engineers, then we as a community need to be credible.

I fully appreciate that Darren has found messages disturbing but without a comprehensive, objective in-depth investigation, diagnosis through a forum is foolhardy; regardless of previous experience. True physical phenomena is rare and needs to be addressed directly not by Hocus Pocus divination. In a genuine case of activity, there is always a need for sympathetic support alongside a realistic approach to resolving or coming to terms with the situation. Fear has always been considered a key factor to the level of activity and as such it should be treated with sensitivity.

If you glibly pronounce to Joe Bloggs who has reported activity in their home, that they have "attachments" causing the problem without doing any research, because it's what you believe, you will make the situation worse by encouraging negative associations with activity that may not actually exist.

I'm sure you'll all of heard of Guy Lyon Playfair and his book on the Enfield Poltergeist, "This House is Haunted". I was lucky to catch up with him at an SPR meeting where they discussed the report. The family were terrified and the activity caused havoc in their day to day life. If you've seen the TV programme on YouTube, you'll be struck by how all invasive it was. What you don't see on that programme is all of the support the family needed and received, at the time and for a long time after.

Unless you're prepared to put out the fire, don't stoke it!

Best wishes,

Rachel

Posted: Jan 28th, 2013 06:53 AM

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64th Post

Rachel EVP Voices Guest   Joined:  Location:    Posts:  Status:  Offline

Hello Gizmo I am sorry too, I hope I didn't upset you as it wasn't my intention to do so. My sincere apologies if I did. You did a good thing in trying to help and I applaud you for trying your best; you used your experience in the subject and applied it. You're in a privileged position to help people and it would be wrong not to help. There's nothing wrong in wishing to make someones life easier. You're an intelligent lady and I'm sure you'll do the right thing. I don't know anything about your field of expertise and wouldn't have a clue with visual aspects of ITC, I've tinkered but nothing more. Maybe we can learn from each other? About 40 years ago I was subject to a period of activity that was to span over 10 years. I will never forget the initial fear I experienced. There was a very unfortunate set of cirumstances that meant seeking outside help was seemingly impossible at the time ( in hindsight it wasn't ). When in control of the situation I vowed to help others going through the same thing. My education in all things occult and metaphysical began at a very early age. I was about 10 when I began my lessons in Wicca and moved only to the scientific side at 25. I tell you and all who read this for a purpose; although I have a very great regard for science, I also have a real passion for the study of the other side too. I often experience a real dichotomy. My spiritual side wants to shout about the communications from the rooftops but the scientific side takes over and I know that for results of experiments to be taken seriously, all things must be considered first. My last word to you all on the subject of attachments and messages, please be careful on discussions with someone you know only over the internet. The onset of psychosis features many aspects that those following spiritual paths may experience. You have no idea who you are talking to and whether they may have mental health problems. I'll belt up now! Rachel

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Posted: Jan 31st, 2013 12:31 PM

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66th Post

Rachel EVP Voices Guest   Joined:  Location:    Posts:  Status:  Offline	Pol, I rest my case!
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