A New Approach - Electronic Voice Phenomena (EVP) - Instrumental Transcommunication (ITC)

ITC Bridge > Instrumental Transcommunication (ITC) > Electronic Voice Phenomena (EVP) > A New Approach

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Jeff
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Greetings friends, normally you would find me contributing to the Spiricom thread. I'm still working on Mark VI, but I had another brainstorm, and thought this thread would be the most likely place for it.

As all of us know, there are many curious, and playful Spirits amongst us. As I pondered that thought, the keyword "playful" came into mind. I began to contemplate a different form of communication than just the spoken word. How about allowing them to simply prove to you their metaphysical presence; and let them enjoy themselves while doing so?

Here it is: Place a Theremin in the room, connected to a sound amplification system. Place the Theremin in the center of the room, and all physical persons placed at least 10 feet away; in a circle, or in a row, it doesn't matter; from the instrument.

Have someone who has consistent contact with one, or more Spiritual entities, to ask them to approach the Theremin. Since the Theremin is a radio frequency device that responds to proximity, it ought to respond by a change of frequency, loudness, or both. Once the Spirits understand how to modulate the instrument, they could (really would) indicate their presence by, changing the tones; and even by answering yes or no questions .

One thing I'm afraid of, is when they start to modulate the tone, they will have so much fun, that communication may never happen! :lol:

For those of you who have never hear of the Theremin: The Theremin is the very first totally electronic musical instrument ever devised. It was built at the turn of the 20th century by one Leon Theremin. The instrument is played by never touching it; but by being in close proximity to its two antennas. The left hand of the player controls the loudness, while the right hand controls the pitch. The close the left hand to the left antenna, the quieter the sound. The closer the hand to the right antenna, the higher the pitch.

You all have heard the Theremin. The Beach Boys used it in their song "Good Vibrations". Yeah, that's that high pitched woo woo sound you hear. The theme song of the original 1960's "Star Trek" utilitzed the Theremin, as well as many 1950's Sci-Fi movies.

Here is Leon Theremin's grand neice, Lydia Kavina, beautifully playing the lovely "Claire de Lune" at a live performance on her Theremin.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xn4TgYkqdi8

Here is a photograph of Moog's Theremin:
http://www.musiciansfriend.com/document?cpd=0OEY&doc_id=99371&base_pid=709302&index=1

Many Blessings!

Jeff

Last edited on Feb 3rd, 2008 02:35 PM by Jeff

EVP_Babs
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Jeff... I love this idea! Brilliant!

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Jeff
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Thank you Debbie and Babs! I don't know if it will work, but the RF and proximity physics are certainly there!

Jeff

EVP_Babs
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Jeff,
I could see even "programming" the words Yes and No in place of the tones.

Jeff
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Sure! Good suggestion! Not hard to do either.

Thanks Babs!

Jeff

Notemanz
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Jeff,

And all members.... I own two theremins and have owned many through the years. This is absolutely a crazy approach.

Yes, the theremin is a "proximity" device and yes, it responds to (Like a tesla globe) to a "wand" (Your Hand). It can go off by itself (mine has a number of times).... Someone can use a garage door opener and this bloody thing can go off.

With all due respect, this is a crazy idea. Here is the thread of a mini theremin for $24.00 if you really want to play around.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=250199020813&ssPageName=STRK:MEWN:IT&ih=015

Heck, why not use a Tesla globe or maybe just try a motion sensor. I'll give you one idea that I've played with which is kinda cool: use a speech recognition program, put it in a very quiet room and see what you get. I've done a couple experiments and I do believe there might be a paranormal application for this technology.

P.S. you may even want to use a drum or wind chimes (Or trumpet as in the old spiritualist days) and have the spirit make noise this way.

I am a professional musician and I would impore you, don't spend $300.00 on a theremin.

Pls. check out the Ebay item above you may find is quite fun.

I've heard a lot of crazy things but I can assure you this is a crazy one for sure. No dis-respect intended but I just don't think members should spend this kind of money for a theremin.

John D

Notemanz
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Debbie wrote: Thanks so much for the idea Jeff!! Now I need to search for a Theremin!

I'll keep you posted! My team is going to be excited!

Debbie

Don't you dare LE!!

LOL

JBE

Notemanz
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P.P.S.S. One can also buy an EMF detector with a type of tone occilator built in. They're about $30 buck and they make a noise when EMF is in proximity.

EEEE

John D

Jeff
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Well! I didn't know we had a raving lunatic within our midst. I'll just take my technology and go elswhere.

Bye all!

Jeff

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lkimberley
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Hi Jeff,

I like the idea worth a shot, stay aboard guy!! We need ya.

And to anyone wanting to accuse anyone one of being crazy, that is not the proffessinal way to bring about ideas. sounds like a partial misunderstanding and classical disagreement about opinions.

But, again I like the idea and some of yours to John.

Thanks,

Laura

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fratka
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I hope you will stick around. I don't think John meant anything by it.... Even though its basically the same language, brits have a way of saying things differently. Watch a few episodes of "Young Ones" or "Fawlty Towers" and you will know what I mean.

Disagreement is part of the learning curve, trust me there are many here who have felt far worse a sting. I say try all and any ideas you have, at the very least you will learn what doesn't work and move on to the next idea.

I hope you change your mind Jeff, you have a lot to offer in technical expertise and a lot to learn as an experimenter. We have some of the best ITC experimenters on this board.

Best Regards,

Frank R.

lkimberley
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Hi Debbie,

This is absolutely a crazy approach.

Maybe I worded it wrong, but, I think someone could take this comment somewhat personally. Jeff sounded so excited and was sharing a view. Again, I will say simply and just my thought, He has a great idea! and I liked some of Johns too! :smile:

Laura

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lkimberley
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Debbie,

LOL thanks for the clarification, I am guilty as charged for being "crazy" lol with all of my own ideas!! :laugh:

But, I guess I wouldn't change the "force or drive in us all" to go in the direction Spirit leads us!!

Thanks GF Have a great day ...made me smile!

Laura

EVP_Babs
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One question I would have is in regards to the proximity. How close does one need to be to "activate" the theremin? Is anything within 10 ft going to activate it? I've now watched several videos of the Theremin in action and the players are obviosly close to control volume but do they have to be that close to cause the tones?

Here is the thing about the EMF meters; I own two TriField Meters. I have yet to have one go off in conjunction with any other notable activity. For instance I've gotten many EVP's in a room with a TriField yet, no changes were noted on the meter. Of course there is no way to be sure how the EVP is made so we can not assume the spirit was close by but... Also, many EMF meters are single axis meters. Depending on the placement of the meter, you may not pick up anything anyway- even if the ghost is right there.

The thing that makes the Theremin most interesting to me is the idea that it could involve spirit personality. "Playful" spirits or those wishing to make contact might far more enjoy manipulating something like this than a boring sounding or dimly lit meter. We also need to consider that the use of the Theremin also brings frequency and tones into the picture. Many are discovering that providing spirit with these things seem to make communication improve. Hence, I would think it beneficial to record for EVP during these sessions. An investigator could also play the Theremin while recording.

If there is an issue or concern that the Theremin "plays" on it's own from electrical disturbances than I would suggest power be turned off (assuming that the Theremin can run on batteries). At the very least, care needs to be given in discovering everything that might cause a false positive. As with everything, the investigator should also take temperature readings, EMF readings, video, etc. if the Theremin begins to play. We might discover that a spirit can manifest visually once combining their energy with the vibrations they manipulate.

The schematics for this are available online and it would cost far less than 300.00 for someone inclined to build one. I think it would be a mistake to not explore this avenue.

Last edited on Feb 5th, 2008 04:32 PM by EVP_Babs

Notemanz
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Jeff and all,

If your reading this Jeff pls. understand that I was not trying to offend. On the contrary, we, I believe, should have a free flow of opinion. I do not profess to be an electronics expert but, I do know a bit about theremins and related audio theory. If one cares to fool with these instruments than of course do so.

I'm not sure if someone thinks I'm British: I'm not. In fact if interested, you can check out my web site which tells more about what I do and the related musical experience I have. (Johndebney.com)

This board is for all and it is refreshingly candid in discussions of Paranormal theory.

And I can assure you, I'm far from a "raving lunatic". I'm amazed that you feel that way and I'm perplexed by your comment.

Sorry if I offended, and I hope you might reconsider your decision.

John D

Notemanz
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Again, I apologize to all as this reaction was quite extraordinary and again, I apologize to Jeff for any hurt and hope he re-considers.

The theremin is a simple device. You use your right hand for pitch and your left hand for volume. Pls.note that there are many many emf detectors that do a similar thing in that they react audibly to present EMF.

Pls. don't spend hard earned money on a new Theremin. There are many many used ones and kits and such on Ebay and the like.

Happy hunting,

John D

EVP_Babs
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Notemanz-

In typical EMF meters, the disruption needs to be pretty close to the meter. How is this different or similar in relation to the Theremin? Was the one you showed in the video an optical theremin? It looked at times that you were blocking a light cell.

Jeff
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Thank you for that John. Apologies for the delay in response. Just busy in many things; I'm sure you understand.

Many, many thanks to Fratka, Lkimberly, EVP_Babs, and Debbie here. All of them came to the rescue!

You say you're a professional musician. Well, so am I. It would be prudent to ask Debbie to play a cover of a song that I recorded in my personal studio. It would put a smile on your face!

Well that's the end of it. We'll talk of it no more.

All is forgiven, my friend.

Many blessings!

Jeff

Notemanz
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Thanks for the comments Evp Babs. The theremin for sure shouldn't "react" to RF, however, they're kind of wacky things and they can go off without warning. LOL They're kind of useless but fun musical things. Simple synthesizers.

The "antenna" senses the movement of your hand. You can vary the pitch by waving your hand in front/up/down etc.... Volume can be controlled via your left hand.

Yes, the little theremin in the ebay thread is fantastic and fun. It does have a light sensing
cel but also reacts to the proximity of your hand in darkness.

What I was considering was a way to incoporate this into my staticom system. Haven't figured it out yet, but the little thing is cool and it's only $24.00.

The theremin only makes simple single occilator (square wave I believe) sounds. The idea of training an entity to communicate with it (again in my humble opinion) is kind of far fetched.

We could, in the same way I guess, have the entity communicate by going close to a good EMF detector too. For instance: "For yes, pls. make the meter jump 2 times..." I have had some success with this and I recommend trying it.

If one wants to purchase a theremin, I'd recommend Ebay as there are some vintage ones that are a lot of fun.

Hope this helps and God bless,

John D

Notemanz
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Thanks Jeff! Truly, didn't mean to offend. I guess sometimes I can be a little abrupt.
Any avenue of research should be explored and I it may indeed be fun to experiment with the good ole theremin. You have to know that I've kinda hated these things for years LOL...

We used to open our show with a big Theremin SOLO!! LOL and it was bad...

Again, thanks for the understanding Jeff and I hope we can contribute to eachother's experimental success's.

Excellent another musician!!

Cheers!
John D

Jeff
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EVP_Babs wrote: Notemanz-

In typical EMF meters, the disruption needs to be pretty close to the meter. How is this different or similar in relation to the Theremin? Was the one you showed in the video an optical theremin? It looked at times that you were blocking a light cell.

Now then Babs, I wish to help you in understanding here. EMF is the annotation for Electro Motive Force. This is simply the pressure applied to a conductor to urge the free electrons to move. The pressure comes from a magnetic field. Just like it takes a fluid pump to generate a pressure (measured in PSI (pound per square inch)) to move a fluid (like water) to flow through a pipe, a magnetic force, measured in volts, compelles the free electrons to follow a conduit. We call that conduit, a conductor. That conductor is normally constructed out of copper; but can be constructed out of aluminum; or other materials that have free electrons in it.

Now that I have bored you to absolute tears, for which I am very sorry, the EMF meter is indicating the magnetic infuences that can move free electrons.

Now I am not psychic, but I'll bet you're wondering "what has this explanation have to do with Spirits?". The answer is I have no idea!". The research has proven that Spirit is made of light.

Well, we only know that light may be of a corpuscule, or wave of nature. And we can bend, or manipulate light by introducing a magnetic force. That magnetic force can be manipulated by varying its potential; in other words, change the magnetic influence on the light.

For example, if, for instance, we have a beam of light, and we wish to manipulate it; change its direction; all we have to do is hold a magnetic force next to it. It will bend. It will even follow our movement of the magnetic field, if we are holding the magnetic object in our hand.

By now, you are totally bored. Sorry for that dear. You were asking for a quick answer; but I would be remiss if I didn't give you a proper explanation.

EMF is simply the magnetic potential to force the movement of free electrons.

Jeff

Last edited on Feb 6th, 2008 10:21 PM by Jeff

EVP_Babs
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I see now. The investigator in me assumed you were speaking of EMF as in Electro Magnetic Field meters and I have yet to be impressed with their usage on paranormal investigations.

One of my short comings in this arena is my lack of a grasp on the technical side. I get the basics but once I attempt to go beyond that... well, my brain deflects and I begin to think of other things.

I'm an idea girl. I can tell you I want to get from point A to point B but not how to do that. I appreciate the patience.

Question: Can light block light?

lkimberley
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Ok EVERYONE....drum...roll.....

It's time for a GROUP HUG!!! :biggrin:

Awwwwwwww. I truly wish I could hug all of you!

Thats wonderful 2 brillant talent men can work it out....I love it!! :wub:

Keeps the energies UP!! :thumbup1:

Live from Old Mexico

Laura

Notemanz
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Great explanation Jeff! Babs, there are many EMF detectors out there. SOme better than others. The tri-filed is excellent in that it can measure different things and it has a sensitivity setting plus an audible chirp when it comes into proximity of field pulses be they electric, magnetic or a sum of the two.

As Jeff stated, there are many theories out there re: the make-up of spirit. I have a canon camera that I've had professionally altered to pick up infra-red spectrum. It has captured some interesting things and also takes some amazing pictures.

Good luck with your work!

Oh guys us musicians always stick together LOL

P.S. Here is one example from beta test 5 of a spiricom like device. We hear:

"The Church of Holy-ies thakns you very much Debbie, Lisa, Margaret, Tesla"

John D

Attachment: ChurchofHoliesThankUVeryMuc.mp3 (Downloaded 1875 times)

lkimberley
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Thank you for sharing that John,

That sounded almost like a water file...But its very interesting.

Could you share how you captured that file, were you communicating live?

How long did you record? and could you explain or possibly share a picture of the way you captured the file? I am very interested.

Very good capture John. I heard most of what you wrote for the file. something right at the end tho...Michael can't find you?

Thanks for sharing,

LK

Jeff
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EVP_Babs wrote:

Question: Can light block light?

The quick answer to that question is no. Light is a composite of the electro-magnetic spectrum that extends from 0 Hz to the unknown. But the example of the rainbow proves to us that all frequencies of light can exist in harmony without interruption one to the other.

Just as many radio frequencies can be broadcasted throughout the atmosphere, to find any one of them is easy by tuning a radio receiver to that fequency. The other frequencies will not interfere.

Another example would be a light curtain. This is a device that, through carefully focused lenses, beams light in the same way a curtain hangs from its supports, to a point. Think of this as simply a curtain, without pleats, hanging in front of you. Now take a flashlight, and aim its beam directly through the curtain of light. The beam from the flashlight will pass freely. However, there will be collision of light particulates.

Let's say the curtain is transmitting the visible spectrum of light. The flashlight is only transmitting roughly 2000 degrees Kelvin. The 2000 K particules of light from the curtain would collide with the beam of the flashlight, and not be blocked, but bend in their direction by careening those particules of that same frequency.

Again, I'm sorry for a long explain.

Hope this helps,

Jeff

Notemanz
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Thanks for listening! This is a work in progress. Here's the set up:

AM radio generating static at 29.9 (Works well at the upper end of the AM dial too)

Output of radio is fed into a six occillator tone generator. I "tune" to the static (Yes it does have pitch)

SO far I tune: Unison....5th...Octave...sometimes a fourth also. I basically am tuning for harmonic resonance.

Then this blend is fed into a Berhinger mixer. Noise reduction is used at the mixer.

The resultant blend is then recorded. I ask questions via a mic that is also into the mixer.

The recorded result is then run thru a Band filter. During this process, words can start to be heard.

Then I use a Yamaha vocorder to "color" the static to give it pitch. (Ala Spiricom)

Now, I'm only acting as a receiver unit with this set up. I'm working under the assumption that "They" are broadcasting on available frequencies.

My theory is that this would be the most logical way to contact us from their side via available frequency that can be picked up on this side.

IThe next step will be to use wireless transmitting/receiving in the system.

Stay tuned for more....

Best,
John D

Notemanz
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Jeff,

Great examples! Do you have science background?

John D

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P.S. Yes, once I get this all put together I'll post a more complete diagram, and picture.

JD

lkimberley
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Hi John,

It all sounds so interesting, and I do look foward to hearing more of your work on this and your setup!!

Thanks for sharing.

Blessings,

Laura

Jeff
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Notemanz wrote: Jeff,

Great examples! Do you have science background?

John D
Thanks John. I'm an electrical engineer.

One thing I need to mention about the light concept is polarization. When light passes a polarizer lens, the energy is focused, and placed in phase as it passes through. When viewed from a right angle of the phased light, the light cannot be seen.

So in this concept, light does not block light, but visible light loses its visibility.

We also need to consider a wavelength filter. It does block light by only allowing a small bandwidth of frequencies to pass throught. All other frequencies cannot pass.

That final thought makes one ponder wavelength, frequency, and the concept of the 7 astral planes George Meeks told us about, doesn't it? Are they simply separated by a kind of filter that as the Spirit frequency increases, it can pass the "filter" to gain access to the higher plane.

Jeff

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How wonderful if we can devise a pair of specs that enable us to "see" them. If we can hear them, we just might be able to see them too...

Great topic Jeff!

John D

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Don't think I dropped off the face of the earth here. I am reading and trying to assimilate the knowledge.

The initial reason for asking if light blocked light was in relation to the theremin video that notemanz posted. I have seen quite a few theremin devices being sold on ebay which operate by something blocking a light cell. If a spirit is made of light and light can not block light than I would assume that anything that operates on that theory will be of no use.

The light conversation also brings to mind something I think about a great deal although I am not sure if it belongs within this thread. The majority of sightings are caught with the peripheal vision. The majority of my sighting are not only caught in my peripheal vision but also when the flash of a camera goes off. I assume this has to do with the refraction of light as well as the rods of the eye. I'm not completely sure where Im going with that thought but perhaps a good conversation can ensue.

Babs

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Great food for thought! Reading "Ghost Of 29 meg" at the moment. Meek is a wonderful character for sure. O'Neill perhaps even more so...

Much to discover! I concur that indeed we may eventually be able to "see" and "hear" them through science.

I'd recommend members google the few sites that convert dig cameras to ultra-violet and infrared. I'm very pleased with my cameras and I feel they may be of interest in Para-normal reasearch.

John D

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EVP_Babs wrote: Don't think I dropped off the face of the earth here. I am reading and trying to assimilate the knowledge.

The initial reason for asking if light blocked light was in relation to the theremin video that notemanz posted. I have seen quite a few theremin devices being sold on ebay which operate by something blocking a light cell. If a spirit is made of light and light can not block light than I would assume that anything that operates on that theory will be of no use.

The light conversation also brings to mind something I think about a great deal although I am not sure if it belongs within this thread. The majority of sightings are caught with the peripheal vision. The majority of my sighting are not only caught in my peripheal vision but also when the flash of a camera goes off. I assume this has to do with the refraction of light as well as the rods of the eye. I'm not completely sure where Im going with that thought but perhaps a good conversation can ensue.

Babs

Gang here is but one Theremin for sale on ebay. This is a smaller version or many full sized models.

http://cgi.ebay.com/Great-sounding-THEREMIN-at-a-Great-Price_W0QQitemZ320216836735QQihZ011QQcategoryZ1287QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

Keith Clark
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Hi All,

Jeff, that was a pretty good and fully creative idea - I find it very interesting myself. Funny enough I watched a movie last night with one of those things in it. I have imagined that something akn to this is most certainly possible - the closest I came was imagining a similar effect with photoresistors.

Cool.

Keith

Jeff
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EVP_Babs wrote: Don't think I dropped off the face of the earth here. I am reading and trying to assimilate the knowledge.

The initial reason for asking if light blocked light was in relation to the theremin video that notemanz posted. I have seen quite a few theremin devices being sold on ebay which operate by something blocking a light cell. If a spirit is made of light and light can not block light than I would assume that anything that operates on that theory will be of no use.

Babs
Hey Babs. I agree with your thoughts on a photo-sensitive arrangement. Most phototransistors work on tight, filtered, infrared spectrum. So any light energy outside of that spectrum would be ignored just because of the nature of the photo sensitive base of the transistor. On those types of sensors, there is actually an infrared transmitter, and infrared receiver. The transmitter is producing the infrared energy via a a lense that focuses the energy away from the receivers lense. When something solid enough to reflect that energy comes withing that focused area, the beam is reflected back into the receiver. This changes the receiver's gain into the amplifier it is feeding. The closer the object, the more, or less gain is produced by the receiver. In the case of the Theremin, the gain is decreased to lower the audio volume of the instrument.

The RF Theremin, which was the instrument I originally posted on, can sense proximity within its RF field. This is why the thought occured to me in the first place.

Hope this helps!

Jeff

Jeff
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EVP_Babs wrote: The light conversation also brings to mind something I think about a great deal although I am not sure if it belongs within this thread. The majority of sightings are caught with the peripheal vision. The majority of my sighting are not only caught in my peripheal vision but also when the flash of a camera goes off. I assume this has to do with the refraction of light as well as the rods of the eye. I'm not completely sure where Im going with that thought but perhaps a good conversation can ensue.

Babs
Good thoughts there. It's so true that from our peripheral vision we do catch movements; snap our heads around to look at the movement; and it's gone. I seriously doubt anyone, who is not blind, has experienced that! If blind, then there is another sense happening!

We know that our eyesight has a blind spot as a result of the optic nerve in the back of our eyes. There are psychology results on record that prove we can sense far more brightness in our peripheral vision than our direct vision. Particularly when our iris is dilated in dim light. There is also the effect that when we hold our eyes to any particular point of focus for any extended length of time, the overall image will have parts of it disappear, and reappear while we watch.

Here's a sample. Scroll down and download the pdf file. Open the pdf file, and set the view for a full page so that the view is at maximum. Stare at the red center block. Do not move your vision from the center block. You will begin to notice, while looking at the center block, the outer blue blocks will begin to disappear, and reappear. This takes a bit of time to happen. If you happen to look at the block that disappeared, it will reappear instantly! That's because our eye electro-chemical reaction is one of the fastest reactions know to man at this time.

I only show this to prove that what we see, is not necessarily what is there. Or better, what we do not see is there.

Regards to all!

Jeff

Attachment: Pattern.pdf (Downloaded 990 times)

Notemanz
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Jeff,

Is there a distinction between the "Rf" theremin and the musical instrument Theremin or are they the same?

Hence wouldn't a good RF proximity sensing meter (tri-field etc.) be similar?

Thanks,

John D

Jeff
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Notemanz wrote: Jeff,

Is there a distinction between the "Rf" theremin and the musical instrument Theremin or are they the same?

Hence wouldn't a good RF proximity sensing meter (tri-field etc.) be similar?

Thanks,

John D
Hi John! No, there are two types of Theremins. One, the original (which is what I had in mind), creates two RF fields. One for pitch; and one for loudness.

The other uses photo controlled amplifiers to control both pitch and loudness.

Your second question asks about a "good RF proximity sensing meter". Well, John; and everyone; these meters are usually manufactured by untraceable manufacturers. By "untraceable" I am referring to others than recognized manufacturers such as Fluke, Tektronix, and Hewlett-Packard.

When Fluke, Tektronix, and Hewlett-Packard produce a device of any kind, they first prove the device in their laboratories, and then send them to the National Institute of Standards and Technology (NIST), http://www.nist.gov (for security reasons, please click on the header of the site to be allowed in) to be compared with the standards of physics that have been established.

The resulting comparison test, if it passes, is given a "trace" number for that instrument; as long as there is no change to the design, or manufacturing process to that instrument. Thereby, that particular instrument has an understood basis for its function(s). Any change in manufacture or design must be 'retraced'. This sets the standard for confidence in that instrument.

Now having said that, these EMF meters that you asked about rarely, if ever, have a trace number; standard of sensitivity, or response to said sensitivity. Therefore, they cannot be included in scientific research of normal, or paranormal kinds.

I hope this clarifies things to not only you, John, but others who read this.

Best to all!

Jeff

Notemanz
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Thanks much Jeff! So if I understand correctly, a meter such as the Tri-field would not be considered appropriate due to no set standard of calibration? If such meters can be used to trace evident EM fields in standard industrial type situations, why then (assuming some paranormal activity might indeed be EM radiation of some type) should these not be used?

Thanks Jeff. I own a number of these units and have indeed recorded some anomolies.

Pls. listen to my recent posts on my Staticom thread I'd love everyone's ears as I'm trying to develop the system further.

Best,

John D

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For members' info I'll list the models and manufacturers of the ones I have. These include simple Gauss meters and some more sensitive models.

J

Jeff
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Notemanz wrote: Thanks much Jeff! So if I understand correctly, a meter such as the Tri-field would not be considered appropriate due to no set standard of calibration? If such meters can be used to trace evident EM fields in standard industrial type situations, why then (assuming some paranormal activity might indeed be EM radiation of some type) should these not be used?

Thanks Jeff. I own a number of these units and have indeed recorded some anomolies.

Pls. listen to my recent posts on my Staticom thread I'd love everyone's ears as I'm trying to develop the system further.

Best,

John D
You're welcome John, and apologies for the delay in response! Yes, you understand correctly!

These hand-held devices are not without value. But allow me to explain: Let's say you're walking through an area that is under suspicion of paranormal activity. Your hand-held device suddenly responds to something. But what is it?

It very well may be responding to a car, with a ham operator calling "CQ", or "hello", as it passes by; or a local police car transmitting. As a volunteer Amatuer Radio examiner, I can tell you, that that transmitter could be producing 1 - 1500 watts of RF power! But unless you have an instrument that can differentiate normal RF energy from what may be paranormal, you cannot determine what is what.

This is why I recommend researchers put away non-known devices; and use known devices based on physical standards; just like the Metascience Foundation did 20+ years ago. Their instruments were the best made at the time. Except for the 13 tone generator, the rest of the instruments were Hewlett-Packard devices from NASA.

Now, if you're using a standard device, it would respond to normal RF energies. That much you can depend. If you have that standard device, along with one of those EMF non-standard devices; and one responds, and the other one doesn't; you now have a situation that you can be suspicious of!

We must compare the known from the variable! :wink:

This is where the research has solidity, and scientific proof!

Hope this helps,

Jeff

Last edited on Feb 12th, 2008 09:09 PM by Jeff

Notemanz
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Very informative! Are there any EMF detectors that you feel comfortable recommending?

John D

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Keith,

Have you tried photoresistors in series with germanium diodes while then using different colors of light? Keep in mind if you don't sheild it, you will get all kinds of local radio stations though.

I got some very interesting results from it. I will have to dig some examples up to post.

Regards,

Frank R.

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No Frank, I haven't. Been too tired lately for electronic stuff. Ideas sounds great though. WIll keep it in mind.

Thanks,

Keith

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Notemanz wrote: Very informative! Are there any EMF detectors that you feel comfortable recommending?

John D

As far as I am aware, the TriField meters are designed to ignore man-made EMF's.

Notemanz
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That is my understanding too Babs but I thought Jeff might give his thoughts too. I've found as he's said, that some of these meters are just crap. There is one that was used on Ghost Hunters that reacts to T.V. remote sugnal and such.

The tri-field seems to be resistant to most types of signal producing false positives.

Best,

John D

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EVP_Babs wrote: Notemanz wrote: Very informative! Are there any EMF detectors that you feel comfortable recommending?

John D

As far as I am aware, the TriField meters are designed to ignore man-made EMF's.
Hi Babs, and John. First, let me clarify: Instruments from AlphaLabs are good ones. I don't want anyone thinking I am in any way saying those instruments are of poor manufacture. They certainly are not.

Babs, correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe you misinterpreted the TriField functions. The TriField meter has several settings, as you know. The basic settings are two for static magnetics (2 different sensitivities), one for electric field strength, and one for RF energy.

If the device is set for electrical field sensing, then the device will not respond to RF, or static magnetic energy; well, not very well anyway, and that is the desired design.

I'm thinking this is what you are interpreting as "ignoring man-made EMF". But when the meter is set for RF, it will respond to any RF it senses. So there is simply no way to differentiate the source of the energy.

A meter than can differentiate, by adjusting its bandwidth of sensitivity, would be like one of the devices manufactured by Bird Electronics. http://www.bird-electronic.com/

If you visit that site, you will immediately see the "Signal Hawk" that has a frequency spectrum display. If an RF energy should be sensed, it would show that "spike" at the frequency. Thereby, the user can instantly see if the RF is within an ITU, or FCC, band that would prove the source of RF is "man-made". In addition, if the user wishes to 'track' that particular frequency, and ignore others (to keep the display 'clean'), then the device can be programmed to do just that. It will also perform frequency analysis (software included), and download that data to your computer for deeper research.

This is the device that the FCC, and other authorities use for RF analysis. It is also listed with the NIST as a traceable instrument.

I know what you and John are thinking. Yup! Very expensive! And I am not advocating everyone to sell their houses to purchase one! This is only for information, and education on the subject matter.

Here's a good example of the Signal Hawk's use in paranormal research for the insanely wealthy: The spirit-safari is on, and the researchers are walking through a suspected area of paranormal activity. One of the researcher's is holding the Signal Hawk in his/her hands (REALLY CAREFULLY) :wink:

. Suddenly, there is a spike in the spectrum display. The spike goes away. The user notices what frequency the spike was at, and finds the spike was not within normal communication bands. The user then slowly moves the device about looking for that same spike. Suddenly that spike appears again, and stays! Now, that user has a scientific reason to pursue asking questions, calling all video, and audio EVP members to the area, and begin good research.

For those reading this, I would offer the following details: If you are a member of a paranormal research team, and have been called to investigate an area (building, or no), it would be prudent to find out the following information before arriving at the site:

1 - Get a map of the locality. Look for any airports, police departments, fire departments, radio stations, television broadcast stations, electrical power substations, commercial utilities (trucks with radios), refineries, or industrial plants (hand-held radios), that might be nearby.
Mark them down on the map.

2 - Call the places in question, and explain to them you are investigating abnormal RF energy near their locale. Explain you require their communication frequency(ies) to program them out of the spectrum under investigation. Personally, I have found that a simple, good explanation will yield favorable results.

3 - In case the contact called is not willing to divulge said frequencies, have no dispair. This is public information that the FCC has to give. Simply call the FCC to obtain the frequencies.

Now, you're sorted out, and ready to get after a good investigation, knowing you have filtered out the normal RF activity that would be present.

Hope this helps!

All the best,

Jeff

Oh! Happy Valentine's Day all!

Last edited on Feb 14th, 2008 07:24 PM by Jeff

EVP_Babs
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Jeff,

I have two TriField Natural EM Meters. There are four settings; magnetic, electric, radio/microwave and sum. "Sum" combines both the electric and magnetic settings.
To the best of my knowledge they are designed to ignore any possible man-made interferences. To date, (approx 4 years and many investigation in many active locales) the meters have not noted any disturbances. I do not hold them but place them in a stable location in areas noted for activity. Many of these type devices are single axis. The TriField Natural is triple axis. When I purchased them, I had high hopes. I have been sorely disappointed.

The peripheal vision topic fascinates me. I have seen two FBA's peripheally as the flash of someones camera fired. Also, I once was able to see someone's aura through the reflection in a mirror. This person is a Reiki Master and quite skilled at manipulating her own energy. I was able to see it expand and retract both from her crown and her hands. This led me to think that seeing "beyond the veil" has to do with light refraction; the light having to bounce off of something near. I've been trying to develop a mirror attachment for a camera lens that would allow the photo to be taken "peripheally". The simple approach would be to use to cameras, one with a flash and one without, place at 90 degree angles next to eachother and fire simutaneously. I'm leaning towards the mirror attachment because although I take very few photos on investigations, the ones that have caught my attention are ones I take over my shoulder try to "catch them in the act".

Now back to the Theramin... Some of the ones I've been seeing utilize light blocking. If a ghost is made of light and light technically can not block light then this approach seems futile. Synchronisticly (sp?) one of my team members has told me he has a friend with a Theramin and we should be able to try it soon. I think it would be of benefit to explain and demonstrate it to the spirits as well. I am looking forward to it.

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Babs,

Good points I agree re: the Tri-field although I've actually had some luck with it.

As to the camera ideas. Here is a link to a great company that can alter your digital cameras to enable them to shoot IR and Ultra-viloet. Highly interesting results so far. I'd recommend this as another tool in your investigations.

http://www.lifepixel.com

Have fun with the theremin. Highly doubtful that it will do what you hope but heck why not!

If you have problems finding one send me a PM and I might be able to ship one of mine to you guys.

Best,
John D

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Hey Babs! Well, yes, I undestand your disappointment in the meters. Sorry you spent the money for them. You see, those meters cannot differentiate, or filter out, what it is exactly what you are looking for. They respond to anything! Well, what was that? You have no idea. Like I said before, that meter may be responding to Police, Ambulance/Hospital, industry, or any other electro-magnetic disturbance. By the way, there can be no differentiation of what is "natural", "supernatural", or "man-made". Period. Sorry you have been deceived. All physical forces in our universe are already there. If man manipulates (modulates) those forces, no-one can tell, except by the standards set by the FCC and ITU. If modulation happens in those bands of frequency, then we can disregard them!

The meters you refer to cannot differentiate what is "man-made" or otherwise. If that needle jumps, you have no idea why. That is why I brought up the Signal Hawk. That device can filter out undesireable emissions of RF, EMF, or electrical fields, as well as Cell Phone, EDGE, Ethernet (TCP/IP, UDP/IP), or many other protocols that are surrounding us all. We live in a new world of RF communications. We are completely permeated with RF of varying power, and frequency, as never before. One cannot just walk into an area with a global responding meter, and believe in whatever the meter is responding to.

One must do the homework. Please, all who read this, do the steps I recommended in the previous post.

Then, and only then can you have confidence in what the instrument is responding to.

Blessings!

Jeff

Notemanz
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Agreed Jeff... I do feel however that the tri-field may be of use depending on the reaction. I will only take note if there is a dramatic number of random "surges" that seem out of the ordinary. Spending time getting base readings is imperative and as Jeff says, try to rule out any reasonable interference....

Is there a firehouse near-by? Police? What is the nature of the locations' wiring.... etc. All things that I bet you guys already do....

I've gathered evp that corresponds to wild spikes in the meter. I make note of the time of any spikes etc. and listen carefully for any potential para normal evp activity at the same time.

In general, Jeff is right on with the cautionary advice...

Best,

John D

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I'm really quite frustrated now. Mostly in myself for not having the technical intelligence I need. I did wonder how the meter could differentiate between man-made and natural believing that "man-made" are simply manipulations of natural.

I always get base readings and have had meters spike but could never determine what might have caused the flucuation. Only once did it seem to correlate to a fellow investigator who began to "channel". Anyway, I've been using them for 6 years and have just about given up on their relevancy besides to detect high base readings. I do, however, like them better than the other gadgets being used like the Cell Sensor. I have to laugh every time I see folks waving them around.

Here is a question- just how far can a radio signal from say a police station travel? If a police station is 3 miles away can I rule it out? If it's 30 miles away....

BTW- I want to comment on the kindness of the members here. You two guys have been extremely kind and patient with me and it does not go unnoticed.

Jeff
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EVP_Babs wrote: I'm really quite frustrated now. Mostly in myself for not having the technical intelligence I need. I did wonder how the meter could differentiate between man-made and natural believing that "man-made" are simply manipulations of natural.

I always get base readings and have had meters spike but could never determine what might have caused the flucuation. Only once did it seem to correlate to a fellow investigator who began to "channel". Anyway, I've been using them for 6 years and have just about given up on their relevancy besides to detect high base readings. I do, however, like them better than the other gadgets being used like the Cell Sensor. I have to laugh every time I see folks waving them around.

Here is a question- just how far can a radio signal from say a police station travel? If a police station is 3 miles away can I rule it out? If it's 30 miles away....

BTW- I want to comment on the kindness of the members here. You two guys have been extremely kind and patient with me and it does not go unnoticed.

Hey Babs! I see now that you are steep on a learning curve! You go girl! Yes, as you have just said, a meter that has a global response to any disturbance really tells you nothing, but that there was a disturbance. Now, I must say your example of a spike at the meter, followed by a channeling of a gifted person, is substantial evidence of Spirit activity. Thanks for mentioning that! Quite honestly, I should have thought of that very scenario before in my previous dissertations.

A police radio has, on the average, 50 watts of RF transmitting power, and can cover roughly 50 miles. Same for ambulatory, fire, and many other RF type communications. So to answer your question "can I rule it out?", the answer is simply no. Aircraft is even much, much farther because of the altitude of the aircraft itself. A typical aircraft radio can transmit over 100 miles quite easily based on the altitude. Oh, and aircraft communications happen around 170+ MHz. Your meter may, or may not have the bandwidth to respond to those freqs, but I would wager it certainly can.

Cell Sensor?! :lol:

Now you're killing me! It amazes me what people will spend good money on. Unfortunately, such people know no better, and others will take very bad advantage of that!

NO! Thank you Babs! I enjoy offering my science and learning to others, like yourself, who really wish to learn, and apply that knowledge to research!

Really, my honor.

Jeff

EVP_Babs
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I know I this is getting away from the original topic here an I apologize.

That being said ;) what about a light detector designed to detect infared light and ignore ambient?

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EVP_Babs wrote: I know I this is getting away from the original topic here an I apologize.

That being said ;) what about a light detector designed to detect infared light and ignore ambient?

Those are readily available, Babs. Please forgive me, but I'm not sure where you are going with this one. Why are you addressing infrared energy? Have you had an experience with Spiritual activity at that wavelength? If so, please let us in!

Most infrared instruments, Babs, are used in thermionic research. Here's one of the excellent hand-held infrared thermometers manufactured by Fluke:

http://us.fluke.com/usen/products/Fluke+568+566.htm

So is your question based on temperature?

Jeff

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Oh, and Babs, you were previously discussing "the corner of the eye" concept.

Well, we know that "what we see", may not be what is going on. In that mindset, here's another visual illusion. What you will see is a circle of pink dots (see below). One of the dots is more pronounced than the others; and rotates along the circle. At the center of the circle is a cross-target. If you stare at the center cross-target, the pink-rotating dot will quickly become green. The surrounding pink dots will begin to disappear.

This illusion proves that "what we see is not what is really there"; or otherwise. Our senses are amazing, yet far from perfect. Not to mention the psychological reception we receive from our senses. This is a psychological demonstration; really has nothing to do with eyesight!

Jeff

Last edited on Feb 21st, 2008 07:20 PM by Jeff

Jeff
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OK, here it is:

Attached Image (viewed 364 times):

EVP_Babs
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Okay, the "dots" hurt my eyes! Thanks Jeff!!

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Notemanz
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Jeff thanks so much for the tutorials!! Gang, Jeff's point re: spending money foolishly is such good advice. Pls. also consider that the Theremin (whcih seems to have piqued interest) is a rather crude musical device that simply makes pitch via the proximity of your hand.

Just as Jeff mentioned the questionable purchase of something like the cell sensor pls. be also cautious when running out to buy a musical device such as this. If you do decide to purchase, have fun with it but my goodness don't expect a ghost to come in and make sounds on it!! LOL

It's as silly as thinking that ectoplasm might come out of it!! (Tongue in cheek!)

Babs, pls. read my thread re: Infra red and UV cameras. These aren't that expensive and I can tell you, we've gotten some very interesting images.

The link is above!

I so appreciate Jeff's expertise. We must all use our common sense and look at the science and physics of the material universe.

Best,
John D

Notemanz
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If interested, here are a few films that employed the theremin:

Day the Earth stood still
Man from Planet X
Lost Weekend
Star trek TOS
Forbidden Planet

And just about every other sci-fi film from the 50's-60's

JD

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EVP_Babs wrote: Okay, the "dots" hurt my eyes! Thanks Jeff!!

I know that the light detectors are available. My thought is that if spirit is light than could they also use the light detector to communicate? The theramin that utilizes the sensor for blocking light won't/shouldn't work but a detector on the other hand....

I'm not exactly sure how the detectors respond but I would think it should be fairly easy to modify the board and have it make a tone, play a song, etc.

Babs, again pls. check out the web site above. If you're interested in light as a medium why no try the cameras?

JD

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EVP_Babs wrote: Okay, the "dots" hurt my eyes! Thanks Jeff!!

I know that the light detectors are available. My thought is that if spirit is light than could they also use the light detector to communicate? The theramin that utilizes the sensor for blocking light won't/shouldn't work but a detector on the other hand....

I'm not exactly sure how the detectors respond but I would think it should be fairly easy to modify the board and have it make a tone, play a song, etc.

Just to clarify Babs, in my original post, I was referring to the RF Theremin with antennas. Just like the one Lydia Kavina plays. Not the photo-sensitive device.

Sorry about hurting your eyes! :wink:

Jeff

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Nice to see you back Estee!

Jeff

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EVP_Babs
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Jeff wrote: EVP_Babs wrote: Okay, the "dots" hurt my eyes! Thanks Jeff!!

I know that the light detectors are available. My thought is that if spirit is light than could they also use the light detector to communicate? The theramin that utilizes the sensor for blocking light won't/shouldn't work but a detector on the other hand....

I'm not exactly sure how the detectors respond but I would think it should be fairly easy to modify the board and have it make a tone, play a song, etc.

Just to clarify Babs, in my original post, I was referring to the RF Theremin with antennas. Just like the one Lydia Kavina plays. Not the photo-sensitive device.

Sorry about hurting your eyes! :wink:

Jeff

Right. One thing just lead to another in my busy mind.